This site is supported by the advertisements on it, please disable your AdBlocker so we can continue to provide you with the quality content you expect.
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Academy Development - cheers Steve?

Discussion in 'Molineux Mix' started by DDPP313, Jan 11, 2017.

  1. DDPP313

    DDPP313 Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    540
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2016
    As a club in recent years It hasn't half been an up and down roller-coaster of a ride. From Solbakken and Saunders almost destroying my interest altogether to the unified revival by Jackett, the trouncing of League One and more recently the visions of grandeur from Fosun.

    But amongst all the mayhem has been the redevelopment of the academy and the emergence of what looks to be a fantastic conveyor belt of youngsters who could stand us in good stead for years to come. Improvements not just in the physical structure of the Academy but how it is run on a day to day basis and the investment in the lads has grown massively.

    In the past we have had varying success with our youth system with some obvious successes but on the whole our youngsters fail to break through and inevitably end up playing in the lower leagues. More recently the players we bring through seem to have a level of technicality rarely seen and the ability to apply it on the big stage, yet I do appreciate it is only early days for the new crop!

    My question is who do we thank, Is it Sir Jack for his stringent terms of reinvestment in the takeover, Steve Morgan for his business and development knowledge regardless of his obvious pitfalls? We all obviously lean towards Sir Jack to who we owe so much but is the Academy the one thing Morgan got right? (I say this through gritted teeth) I am sure some on here can shed more light on just how these improvements came about and the varying influences of different people.
     
  2. ShifnalWolf

    ShifnalWolf Groupie

    Messages:
    202
    Likes Received:
    130
    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2016
    Steve Morgan (cue the abuse.....)

    I feel the academy and the new North bank is his legacy (with Upper NB seats being fantastic for my 6'4" frame!!
     
  3. DDPP313

    DDPP313 Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    540
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2016
    It is starting to appear that way! It will be interesting to look back in 10-20 years time
     
  4. PumpKing

    PumpKing Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    5,732
    Likes Received:
    983
    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2008

    Agreed, Steve Morgan was not all bad by any means. Credit where credit is due.
    Our academy is superb, both Steve and of course Sir Jack were responsible for this and deserve our thanks.
     
  5. brightside

    brightside Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    4,013
    Likes Received:
    2,078
    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2015
    Morgan did a great job with the academy and hopefully we'll see the benefits over the next couple of years.
     
  6. WKFWolf

    WKFWolf Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,238
    Likes Received:
    97
    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2012
    dont start talking about hindsight on here, you'll be vilified! ;)
     
  7. Derby Wolf

    Derby Wolf Senior Member

    Messages:
    766
    Likes Received:
    594
    Joined:
    May 27, 2016
    Sir Jack with the exception of the stadium was very boom and bust. He'd throw money at Taylor, McGhee and Jones with a get us up mandate with no real strategy. I loved the guys passion but he was like a dog chasing its tail, if he caught it he wouldn't know what to do. As proven in 2003-04. Similarly, it was Graham Taylor's idea for a real training ground which wasn't realised by Rick Hayward until what? 2006?

    Steve Morgan was more long term strategy improving the infrastructure and building links with the council, university and the Academy. So much so his strategy strangled the progress of the first team in the here and now with limited funding.

    Both men were impulsive and emotional; Sir Jack see the Golden Tit outburst, Morgan see dressing room incident/appointment of Saunders. A stronger CEO may have been able to temper those outbursts but I doubt Jez would have had nearly as much longevity if he did.
     
  8. WolfLing

    WolfLing Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,517
    Likes Received:
    953
    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2016
    I was wondering who would be brave enough to be first to pass comment about Morgan's Academy development!

    The man made some terrible decisions during his time here, but by far the best thing he did was the investment in the club's infrastructure. The facilities at Compton are incredible and we will benefit from them for years to come. The players beginning to come through this season is only the start of it.

    Credit to Morgan and Morgan only - Jez was just a passenger.
     
    Okresh, BrummieNick and DDPP313 like this.
  9. TornadoTed

    TornadoTed Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    60
    Likes Received:
    35
    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2017
    We do have a lot to thank Morgan for, the infrastructure upgrades will see us in good stead for years ahead. He certainly had a vision, and one I'm sure a lot of us share, a fantastic ground with large crowds and a thriving academy, his big mistake was that he seemed to lose sight of the 'here and now' gazing towards the future.
     
    Okresh likes this.
  10. Simmowolf

    Simmowolf Senior Member

    Messages:
    932
    Likes Received:
    12
    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Steve Morgan does deserve credit, but Graham Taylor started it from memory.
     
  11. Mr Wolf

    Mr Wolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    18,097
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2006
    I think I'll wait until one of them has scored a goal, played consistently for run of games keeping their place in the side or been sold for £10m before branding it a roaring success.

    No doubt the training ground & academy are all positives from Morgan's tenure though.
     
    Adrian_Monk and WeAreTheWolves like this.
  12. DDPP313

    DDPP313 Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    540
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2016
    I agree, Fosun seem to have acknowledged the Academy also.

    In the penny pinching past the youth teams would have to travel up to the likes of Blackburn and Newcastle on the day of the game, now they travel up the night before and stop over in the same way the first team do. Small things like this make a difference to the young lads and importantly the parents.
     
    Okresh, BrummieNick and WolfLing like this.
  13. DDPP313

    DDPP313 Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    540
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2016
    It is no doubt still a work in progress but the attention and investment is there and it should only improve
     
  14. Mr Wolf

    Mr Wolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    18,097
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2006
    As we hopefully improve the 1st team it might leave the academy behind, currently being a lower championship club a few young players should get a chance & make the grade you would hope, if we're pushing for promotion that gap in theory becomes bigger.

    So having 5/6 players in your firsts team because you're **** doesn't necessarily mean your academy is thriving likewise have 1 on your bench because you're doing well doesn't mean it's failed.

    If these lads get involved, play plenty of games & improve our position then yes it will have been a success.

    If you sort of get what I mean, bit rushed at work.
     
  15. DDPP313

    DDPP313 Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    540
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2016
    I do understand what you are saying and it is still very early days for most of the lads coming through. But there is an internal acknowledgement of importance of the Academy from the bottom to the very top and we are starting to see the benefits now.
     
  16. WalsallWolf

    WalsallWolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    9,093
    Likes Received:
    634
    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    Ha ha some will struggle with this thread!

    But yes, Morgan deserves recognition, as he did anyway. Even moreso in say 10 years time as I think then we will have produced some top class players. He left a club in fantastic shape. An Investment company like FOSUN do not invest in something that is in poor shape.

    There is an irony to it all really, we was up in arms at the departure of Morgan and the arrival of FOSUN back in July. The money, potential signings etc.

    Yet the vast majority of the signings have in reality been poor, decision making has been woeful - and you get the feeling come May the story and highlight of the season will revolve around Morgan's legacy.

    Interesting.
     
    brightside likes this.
  17. Mugwump

    Mugwump Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    4,670
    Likes Received:
    1,139
    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2015
    It's still too early to give Morgan any recognition tbf. The academy is starting to produce what looks like a promising crop of kids, but they have proved nothing yet. I agree with Mr Wolf, I'll reserve judgement until they start producing the goods in thirst team on a regular basis.

    Morgan provided the funding for the academy, but I think Gareth Prosser deserves a lot more credit than he gets. We were struggling a bit after Evans left with the direction we were going in, but he has definitely turned things around and made us a more attractive club to join again.
     
    Rubberball likes this.
  18. DDPP313

    DDPP313 Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    540
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2016
    But surely we have to give him credit for at least laying the foundations (excuse the pun) for a highly successful category 1 academy? We at least have the infrastructure now to compete with our nearest neighbours. I know of two players who are not that far off the first team now who were very close to joining WBA but were won over by the new investments. One of which signed back in 2009 as a real young nipper!
     
  19. TrueWolf

    TrueWolf Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,007
    Likes Received:
    836
    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2016
    I think the reality is quite simple, Morgan did well with the Academy and Infrastructure investment but it was at the cost of first team investment.

    An investment in youth like this was never going to pay dividends for 5 - 6 seasons so people may well look back now and say maybe he had a long term vision and we are only now seeing the benefits. And this is probably true and he should be commended for that.

    However what I think is also true is that he moved on at the right time because he clearly didn't have the capital required to push the club to the next level and sustain that level.

    I think his legacy will be that he set the stage, did the hard things that were at the time perhaps not popular but have now set us in the right place as an attractive investment for a company with that capital to take us forward.

    The lauchpad is ready now lets just see if Fosun are able to light the fuse.
     
  20. WalsallWolf

    WalsallWolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    9,093
    Likes Received:
    634
    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2008
    I think you have hit the nail right on the head.
     
    TrueWolf likes this.
  21. DDPP313

    DDPP313 Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    540
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2016
    One thing I always wondered was did Morgan invest in bricks and mortar (and land) purely due to the terms and conditions set by Sir Jack about investment?

    By investing in long term infrastructure did Morgan guarantee he could make a tidy profit whilst doing the bare minimum with the first team investment? He certainly showed no ambition to try and keep Sako and Afobe, and he appeared to simply cash in on Afobe
     
  22. Mugwump

    Mugwump Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    4,670
    Likes Received:
    1,139
    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2015
    Any half decent owner in this day and age, especially at a club like ours should be investing in their clubs infrastructure anyway. I'm not trying to give him no credit, as he did believe in it and put his money where his mouth is.
     
  23. Black Coffee

    Black Coffee Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,172
    Likes Received:
    28
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2012
    Steve deserves a lot of credit and I say this through gritted teeth Glenn Hoddle deserves some credit too as he was the one who pushed the hardest to redevelop Compton when he was here.
     
  24. TrueWolf

    TrueWolf Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,007
    Likes Received:
    836
    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2016
    I think that is a question you will probably never know the exact answer to. All we were told is that Sir Jack sold he club for £10 on the promise that Morgan would invest £30 million (is that right?).

    I don't think we will ever know the specifics or if there were ties to 'how' that investment should be spent.

    But the fact that Mogan followed through on that instructed or otherwise earns him some credit.
     
    astraltrader likes this.
  25. Wolowolf6

    Wolowolf6 Groupie

    Messages:
    97
    Likes Received:
    35
    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2015
    I can't tell if you're being sarcastic here, I suspect so as I'm always sat with my legs around my ears in the NB.
     
  26. DDPP313

    DDPP313 Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    540
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2016
    'Glenn Hoddle deserves some credit'

    Now I never thought I would see that on The Mix! :D
     
    astraltrader and Black Coffee like this.
  27. Black Coffee

    Black Coffee Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,172
    Likes Received:
    28
    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2012
    It's the only good thing I can say about his tenure here in fact I felt a bit queasy typing the idea of him deserving some credit.
     
    DDPP313 likes this.
  28. Benson

    Benson Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    2,675
    Likes Received:
    805
    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2016
    Morgan made mistakes but also made some good things. He deserves credit for the good things, of course. Our Academy and the Youth Center in town are two of the good things. Three years in Premier League is another. We have already had several threads about his mistakes and no need to talk about them again.

    Hopefully we will see some/lots of youth players develop to senior starters over the next years. It looks really really good at the moment, and hopefully its not just a "lucky group" and we will see some "own" players in the team for many years.
     
    Ashley, brightside and DDPP313 like this.
  29. astraltrader

    astraltrader Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    8,593
    Likes Received:
    1,630
    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2005
    Sir Jack and Morgan both deserve recognition for the academy.
    In Morgan's case it is arguably his only legacy whereas in Sir Jack's case we owe him much.
     
    TrueWolf and DDPP313 like this.
  30. Chiswick_Wolf

    Chiswick_Wolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    4,478
    Likes Received:
    40
    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2006
    Morgan was like a General preparing for war, whilst outside his tent a battle raged.

    I always thought Morgan was right to focus on how we could be more self-sustaining in the future as FFP restricts some of the power that spending alone could generate. However, he was so focused on delivering that (which I believe he wished to be his legacy) that he failed to invest adequately in the first team squad - particularly in that 3rd Premier League season.
     
  31. Mr Wolf

    Mr Wolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    18,097
    Likes Received:
    1,304
    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2006
    What are you about 6"8, the NB has loads of room (not just the empty seats) try the £30 Steve Bull upper if you want see cramped.
     
  32. Mile End Wanderer

    Mile End Wanderer Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,175
    Likes Received:
    166
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2016
    Steve Morgan only did it so we could spend less on transfers but thanks Steve... Those 500k redrow homes down Compton look nice
     
  33. SteveBullsKnee

    SteveBullsKnee Groupie

    Messages:
    318
    Likes Received:
    139
    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2015
    I think now we are away from it and can take a step back we can see Morgan wasnt all bad. He made mistakes but he delivered 3 years of Premier League Football and a first class training ground and a much sought after Academy. He just got some key decisions wrong in the short term. He needed to invest more in the last season in the prem (though at the time with the addition of JOH and RJ most thought we had done enough). He supported Solbakken well in the summer with a £12 million spend, unfortunately he was out of his depth and so was his replacement. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.
     
    brightside likes this.
  34. DDPP313

    DDPP313 Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,023
    Likes Received:
    540
    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2016
    Indeed it is, It doesn't help that we can see some of our closest neighbors laying down a real foundation in the premier league with the likes of Albion and Leicester light years ahead of us in many respects
     
  35. SteveBullsKnee

    SteveBullsKnee Groupie

    Messages:
    318
    Likes Received:
    139
    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2015
    I wouldnt say they are light years ahead. We are pretty much in the same place off the pitch, infrastructure wise. In fact, we might be slightly ahead, our training facilities are better and I know first hand that our academy is and is highly thought of in football circles. On the pitch is ultimately where we are behind (and ultimately what we base things on) but thats a short term solution. Im not saying they will or indeed want to, but if Fosun wanted to give PL £500 million to spend we would overtake both clubs in two seasons.
     
  36. JR's Boots

    JR's Boots Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    2,592
    Likes Received:
    77
    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2006
    Morgan's biggest mistake was the retention of Moxey who poisoned any goodwill towards their regime and lacked the vision, competence to consolidate in the PL.
     
    WolfLing likes this.
  37. Essex Wolf

    Essex Wolf Just doesn't shut up

    Messages:
    40,643
    Likes Received:
    1,117
    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2005
    Fair points and about the best I can say of his tenure.

    This. Much as I dislike Morgan and what he put the club through credit where it's due but I don't think Morgan did much that he didnt gain from.

    What are you saying?;)

    Together they were a nightmare.
     
  38. WolfLing

    WolfLing Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,517
    Likes Received:
    953
    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2016
    Yes. Morgan built a good house, with very good foundations, but hated the idea of furnishing it!!

    Fosun came in to a fairly empty house and within a month bought two bathtubs with holes in, a pool table, an antique chest of drawers and borrowed 5 chairs that didn't match.

    So this January we are having a clear-out and then seeing what we need from Ikea.
     
    Paul76 and TrueWolf like this.
  39. Mile End Wanderer

    Mile End Wanderer Has a lot to say

    Messages:
    1,175
    Likes Received:
    166
    Joined:
    Feb 3, 2016
    I thank him for the academy but under his tenure the club didn't progress we started in the championship and ended up back there via league one and a new stand
     
  40. Optimistic Hove Wolf

    Optimistic Hove Wolf Senior Member

    Messages:
    600
    Likes Received:
    126
    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2013
    Totally agree. Was just about to write (type?) similar myself.
     

Share This Page